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2023 Israel-Hamas war: Micah's Idol (Part 2)

saturnz said:
how do you determine what is evil?

according to what principles do you arrive at that conclusion? only religion identifies evil and good- (edit- and in this secular world we deal with what is legal and illegal, morality has very little to do with anything)

what people do and what religion states though are also a different story

for example the palestinians as you claim are muslim, but does islam encourage a nation state ruled by democracy with central banks? so that already suggests the muslims are not following their supposed doctrines on governance so why would they follow the marriage doctrines
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Religion does not have any rights to own morality. Morality pre-dates religion. When the first monkey decided that instead of attacking a someone not in his family group, he would befriend them instead.

In order to establish the basis for what is morally good or bad, you need to define that the goals for morality are. For me its the following two goals in the following order:
  1. The least amount of suffering for the most people.
  2. The best ability to pursue fulfillment in life for the most amount of people.
From there, you can evaluate and consider everything that is good or evil. decide what society values and abhors and finally write laws on.

Where religion fails is in the way it constructs morality from its goals:
  1. Centralize and direct power the the elite of society (the founders of the religion).
  2. Protect the elite from the consequence of wielding this concentration of power.
  3. plus some secondary goals not needed for this discussion.
If you consider the above, this is how you get a mind-virus that is used to make otherwise good people (by humanist moral standard) to do evil things. How its scriptures are filled with the admiration of rapests, muderers, opressors and the sanction of the genocide of entire nations based on their lack of believe. And don't forget the all important mandate to evangelize to non-believers and to kill the ones that reject it.

A small infant knows how to make friends and how to act with compassion for others. We are born with a natural genetic instinct for morality, developed over millions of years of evolutionary pressure based on which tribes and societies were successful or not. But it takes a lifetime of indoctrination to make someone a suicide bomber, or to think that child marriage is a good thing.
 
Vorastra said:
Will the UN push for a peacekeeping force, will Israel tolerate it, and will the UNSC allow it?
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Yep, time for the UN to nut up or shut up.

I would respect Biden just a little bit if he comes out in support of a UN peacekeeping force and cessation of offensive military equipment to Israel. They can instead replace it with a defensive guarantee from attacks by a nation state.
 
Sapphiron said:
Yep, time for the UN to nut up or shut up.

I would respect Biden just a little bit if he comes out in support of a UN peacekeeping force and cessation of offensive military equipment to Israel. They can instead replace it with a defensive guarantee from attacks by a nation state.
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That's not Israel's goal. Israel's goal is to absorb Gaza and the West Bank.
The US seems to do whatever Israel tells it to.
 
Vorastra said:
Explain the Saudi position.
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The Yemeni government is largely considered a puppet of the Saudi state.

So long as the Yemen civil war continues Yemen needs Saudi support. and the Saudi's want that dependency to continue controlling large parts of the oil industry in Yemen.

something important I omitted is that Iran is backing the other side, because they seek to disrupt Saudi control of the oil industry in Yemen. Standard middle eastern oil politics.
 
Sapphiron said:
The Yemeni government is largely considered a puppet of the Saudi state.

So long as the Yemen civil war continues Yemen needs Saudi support. and the Saudi's want that dependency to continue controlling large parts of the oil industry in Yemen.

something important I omitted is that Iran is backing the other side, because they seek to disrupt Saudi control of the oil industry in Yemen. Standard middle eastern oil politics.
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But it's the Houthis causing the issue. The Houthis are the ones Saudi Arabia has been fighting.
 
Vorastra said:
But it's the Houthis causing the issue. The Houthis are the ones Saudi Arabia has been fighting.
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Yes, but there has been criticisms that the Saudi's are not giving enough support to get rid of the problem
 
Sapphiron said:
Yes, but there has been criticisms that the Saudi's are not giving enough support to get rid of the problem
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Why would the Saudis be purposefully taking their time to remove the only obstacle between them and controlling Yemen.
 
Vorastra said:
Why would the Saudis be purposefully taking their time to remove the only obstacle between them and controlling Yemen.
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Easier to steal the oil

new.thecradle.co

Who is looting Yemen's oil, and where does it all go?

There is a hidden war being waged against Yemen, a multinational assault against the country's vital natural resources. For years, foreign states and companies have engaged in the illicit plundering of Yemen's oil and gas - war profiteering in the poorest nation in West Asia.
new.thecradle.co new.thecradle.co
 
Sapphiron said:
Easier to steal the oil

new.thecradle.co

Who is looting Yemen's oil, and where does it all go?

There is a hidden war being waged against Yemen, a multinational assault against the country's vital natural resources. For years, foreign states and companies have engaged in the illicit plundering of Yemen's oil and gas - war profiteering in the poorest nation in West Asia.
new.thecradle.co new.thecradle.co
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This smells a lot like how the US is illegally in Syria stealing oil. Interesting.
 
Sapphiron said:
Yes, but there has been criticisms that the Saudi's are not giving enough support to get rid of the problem
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The Saudis are in the view that the issue needs to be controlled at sea, and not to result in regional escalation or rather turmoil. The Saudis have been cooperating with both the US and Israel, and seeing the US’s itinerary every time they travel on security business to the Middle-East, the UAE is a priority. The Saudis and the Qatari are likely to advance a land bridge to sidestep the issue at sea. The thing is, that this land bridge is also what China is pushing which is what the US is pushing against.

Then there are logistical (and transport) concerns, since trade routes would need to be adapted which would involve more shipping companies and ships. Guess who will grab at these opportunities.
 
Israeli housing developer talking about building and selling beach-side properties in Gaza.

This is what compassion looks like.

Screenshot_2023-12-16-18-01-05-565-edit_com.twitter.android.jpg

From their Instagram. Seems real.

chrome_screenshot_16 Dec 2023 18_10_28 GMT+02_00.png
 
Interesting read up on that company. They seem to be intent on taking back the Israeli settlement bloc in Gaza. These will be the areas in blue on this map:

Gaza_strip_may_2005.jpg


Though I assume that they will expand on the old bloc. They advertise it very openly. As said by Likud, Oslo is done.
 
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